Sig, take this firearm off the market, and recall. It takes time for any new platform to work the kinks out. As they should. Im more of a DS9 guy. Additional questions about the Voluntary Upgrade Program are answered in the FAQ. I went to an outdoor public range with a local SWAT entry team leader. ! while being accompanied by some form of obvious stupidity like putting an unholstered gun in a gym bag with other stuff. ! only reveals ones immature emotional attachment to an inanimate object, which reveals a pretty childish worldview. Asked if the guns in these cases could have been mishandled, Villani responds, When I see videos of police officers getting out of their car and their weapon discharges in their holsters, nah, theres a problem with the gun. ABC then ran bodycam footage of a pre-upgrade P320 firing as a Michigan state trooper exited his patrol car in 2016 with no mention of the results of any subsequent investigation. The military is much smarter and no, the gun is not junk. Seems a bit apologetic to me. I have almost a hatred for Glocks but the one thing that they are is reliable. Sigs are crap! Thats the same. The best take on this subject is by the author himself: this is about slime lawyers looking to build a national narrative and get a few wins in, so they can more easily get the next win and the next one, the next one and so on. Yes, but that did not mean the machine would be able to go on being marketed like that. Their visceral hatred for that which they see as competition to their little golden calf god and their blind, myopic, childish self-identification with an external dynamic is hilarious! Police Department, was wounded when his P320 duty gun discharged without a trigger pull while he was carrying it in a gym bag wrapped carefully with a cloth. Officer Collette was wounded in his left leg. Its just that with hundreds of millions of firearms in the hands of more than one-third of the countrys population including a lot of cops some number of negligent discharges will inevitably happen. Period. Which in and of itself is user error / misuse. Liberal, Conservative. The Nightline segment includes an interview with Major Peter Villani, an expert (paid) witness for Hilton. Being prosecuted and convicted of a third degree felony in Texas can lead to: Incarceration in a Texas state prison for a term of two years or up to 10 years. I lost $200 on a gun that had less then 1000 rounds through it but I could care. Give me a break. Who knows. You couldnt ask questions. Just because someone shoots hyper-unrealistic 3 gun competition, subscribes to Recoil magazine and routinely watches their fave rave YouTube cult of personality channel shill for the latest company that paid him off doesnt make them a [emailprotected]$$. You clanging a bell that went silent years ago. No picture for me. And people have a way of looking for ways to deflect blame for those discharges, especially when they stand to lose their job as a result. The military is already shopping for a new sidearm. A shame but then no one was hurt. Really? TAMPA, Fla., July 27, 2021 /PRNewswire/ -- A 30-year veteran law enforcement officer with the Tampa Police Department (TPD) today filed a lawsuit against Sig Sauer, Inc., the maker of his. 1:07. In 2020, the agent, who is a former marine, was doing his routine training with the P320. I call b-s on all these my gun magically went off. That said, I own multiple P320s, but all of them have the manual safety due to personal preference. The moral of all of this is the reason Sig got the military contract was because they were selling guns at close to cost, they underbid Glock by a significant margin. selling the 365 with strikers breaking? Training and experience are not a talisman that magically prevents accidents. You should always use a real holster, or carry it condition 3 or 4 if its off-body. Capitol Police Officers Explanation for Shooting and Killing Ashli Babbitt Is Riddled With Problems, The City of Wichita Raked In Almost $200,000 Selling Seized Guns in the Last Five Years, State Judge Issues Order Blocking Enforcement of Illinois Firearms Ban Act Statewide, Federal Judge Grants Injunction Blocking Enforcement of ATFs Frame or Receiver Rule, Illinois Rep. Bob Morgan: Anything Stamped M&P is a Weapon of War, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-ZZ6pynGLM, https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/dea-agent-lee-paige-still-wont-go-away/, https://sofrep.com/news/dod-evaluation-says-armys-new-sig-sauer-p320-service-pistol-riddled-issues/, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0LUbLu6TqA, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jsu6WsSQ2_g, https://millsentertainment.smugmug.com/William-Shatner-The-Wrath-of-Khan. I dont care about the upgrade that should never happen. SIG says ABC had intended to include some of those other claims in their reports, but after SIG informed the network of the additional information that was uncovered, those cases werent included in either of the segments. Then either the gun somehow managed to magically clear both the broken tab and foreign body to continue to operate. So does any of this mean theres something wrong with the P320? Trying to categorically say Brand X is better than Brand Y! Post again when you buy a real gun that you can defend yourself with. The trigger bar has to push up on it, for it to release. -You plan on getting rid of your P320, great! And those are exactly the kinds of plaintiffs who happen to make up the vast majority of the lawsuits filed against SIG. Stinking Lawyers and quota cops. And the fact they used real models, and big ones, gives the ships a real sense of heft, mass, movement and solidity that the garbage CGI ships of the new movies just cannot remotely compete with. That wont last for long, the P320 (M17 AND M18) are already failing in the field. three changes to the original design. The new Tauruses have a good rep, far better then the P320 or P365. Sep 20, 2021 613 571 Idaho. MIM strikers made in India and put into Sigs. All polymer guns are cheap, cheap, cheap to make, thats why I threw the Taurus name into the mix. This leads me to conclude that the problem is not the gear but the moron using it. Again, these are examples the plaintiff in this case is using to support his claim that the P320 is prone to un-commanded discharges.. Have you ever noticed that big trouble usually comes in groups of 3. . Yesterday, a Canadian news outlet, CBC News, published a story regarding the unintended discharge last year of a SIG P320 by a Canadian Special Operator, resulting in injury and his unit withdrawing the pistol from service. Thread starter ut755ln; Start date Oct 19, 2022; Forums. https://sofrep.com/news/dod-evaluation-says-armys-new-sig-sauer-p320-service-pistol-riddled-issues/. (It wasnt my gun). . Then after just three years without telling anyone they stopped all production including extra parts. The more someone touches, loads, clears, cleans, holsters, un-holsters, or otherwise deals with their firearm, the higher the statistical likelihood that complacence kicks in. I have been purchasing and using Sig firearms exclusively for over 40 years. Thinking its okay to wrap a loaded gun in a towel and toss it into a gym bag is what we get when departments refuse to hire candidates who score too high on IQ tests. The thing I hate is getting kicked around! Sig can burn for all I care. It was expensive. Thats why the US Marines have Sigs. 1.A rush to market, and as usual the blind greed of the gun companies who no longer test pistols before marketing them think it is cheaper (so the idiots think) to let the public test them. Sig Sauer's P320 is widely used by police departments across the country, and is a big seller in the civilian market, with about half a million sold nationwide. The truth is the absolute WORST semi-autos that Sig, H&K, Walther, Beretta or Glock makes today are more reliable than the best semi-autos made 40 years ago, by far. Is there any major military anywhere that ever issued one of their guns? Bagnell is representing a number of the police officers who have filed suits against SIG for un-commanded discharges, but wouldnt disclose the exact number. The problem is non-existent. How about something more relevant. Kyle . So if, say, a person was to accidentally get shot through no fault of their own and need to sue, which specific cartridge/appendage combo would yield the most favorable least pain/permanent-damage : highest-payout ratio? It doesnt matter whether SIG is at fault or not. Use a proper holster and follow other gun safety protocols. The thing is, youd probably need to generate many Gs of force in both directions simultaneously. I guess none got her the attention she wanted and a national coverage so she went in for the bang. The bullet struck a soldier in the leg. Depending on who you talk to you will get many different answers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jsu6WsSQ2_g. Sig fanboys are almost as bad as Glock fanboys. Golly didnt Sig catch he!! The modular SIG P320 is among the most widely-owned handguns on the planet. And it doesnt take too much Googling to find plenty of reports of LEOs suing the Georgia company as well (see here, here, here, and here for just a few). Its not happening on your person without some catastrophic event. Then without any extra effort, the normal trigger pull caused the tab on the drop safety to sheer off. is the manual safety a kit you add? My gun just went off! This is this same company that couldnt build their own freaking rifles after multiple attempts (Sig SG550 series) when that rifle had been made in Switzerland for years without issue. Instead we see a Sig that is ran by Mr. Cohen of Kimber fame have repeated quality and product development failures. But I hope Sig fights it until the bitterest of ends. What it likely means is that cops and other law enforcement officers carry and handle their guns far more often than the average Joe or Jane. Holding the striker fully cocked with nothing to block it if the sear fails is questionable at best. Likewise, having a finger in the trigger-guard, or a clothing draw-string, or a retention strap, or some other object, when holstering the gun exonerates the maker, as the gun is firing with a trigger press of sufficient energy and stroke as designed. Manual safeties on pistols, hammer and striker fired systems were found necessary as far back as 1900. You simply may not PREFER one make to another, or may simply dislike another make, but were to the point in semi-auto pistol production history where amongst the big brands, the only real distinctions are preference. Really, that JJA ship looks like something the folks at PlaySkool built, its terrible. So, unlike the Serpa holster debate, Im a believer that there is more going on than meets the eye with the P320 and is exactly why I refrained from buying one, why I still wont own one, and why I steer people away from it. Excellent work. My elderly aunt drove her Volvo into a parked car, and the yard behind it, and the house behind that, while she was pressing the brake as hard as she could. Strangely the car kept accelerating, almost as if she were flooring the gas pedal. Cars have so many electronics these days, who knows what could have gone wrong! So are dumb(or arrogant) cops. ABC ran their story on the P320 twice, but with some significant differences between the two reports. 3) If the sear fails, there is the drop safety in the way of the striker. Each incident gives them more blood for their macabre dance, and another tic-mark for their context-free gun violence tally. Sig P320 discharge while holstered. After the accident the unit returned to using the SIG P226 they had planned to replace with the P320. A fine of up to $10,000. . None of the current lawsuits appear to be in any way related to the now-fixed drop safety issue and most, if not all of the allegations seem to involve upgraded pistols or those produced after the drop safety problem was identified by SIG. Slowly people are realizing they arent the only ones having issues. Hilton's $15 million lawsuit said, "there have been 54 reported uncommanded discharges of the P320," meaning the gun went off by itself, over the last five years in 22 states and Washington, D.C. The Collette suit, for example, lists 39 such discharges, all but five of which involved law enforcement officers. This website has been messed up all week so that might be the problem in replying. But Im observant enough to see the same voices that said in 1985 that This new fangled Glock is a just a plastic toy! Anyway there was one good thing to come from those movies, The USS Vengeance. Grow up, you aint all that! To make the striker leg pull off of the sear, you would have to impart a lot of rearward momentum and stop it suddenly. Dont care for them, not my jam. His annual qualification consisted of shooting 32 rounds. I still own them all. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. Glocks have gone off when people attempted to holster them and after they have holstered them, some times way later after holstering them like the fellow that got into his pickup truck. D. 2. Dont quote the four rules of safety in your article when all the hotness in the gun world is appendix carry pointing something at an extremity and the photos you use showing front slide serrationsputting your hands fingers near the business end of the barrel, because press checks from the front is the way all the cool operator guys do it. But Shatner? The incident with the P320 - a contender for a major Canadian Armed Forces procurement of thousands of pistols and holsters that has a Aug. 3 deadline for industry proposals - occurred at JTF-2's Dwyer Hill training range just west of Ottawa. Too expensive to use their customers as beta testers. Had a buddy, years ago, that was a deputy for Orange County in California. It has an unsafe takedown procedure that requires you to pull the trigger to get the slide off. Ironic that the trendsetters of yesteryear are trying to tear down the innovator of today because its Not perfected yet! and the Design isnt worked out!. The linkage isnt, but the way the striker leg and sear face mate up, the two materials being MIM castings, the small camming action, etc. As for Seals they have their own contract with Glock but can carry anything they want. If the military was going to go cheap then they should have thrown Taurus into the mix. On February 19, 2021, Military.com reported: A former U.S. Marine and federal agent has filed a $10 million lawsuit against Sig Sauer Inc. alleging that his holstered Sig P320 a pistol that the Army's new sidearm is based on accidentally discharged, firing a 9mm bullet into his right leg. No you haters are not smarter than the US military, who tested the P320 far more than your favorite YouTuber ever did. And yes, if I pulled some of those stunts, Id have my membership revoked. No, it doesnt. SIG Sauer, a German weapons maker with its U.S. headquarters in Newington, N.H., issued a statement Friday in response to a CBC News report earlier this week that revealed the Nov. 5, 2020, incident and the fact the weapon, the SIG P320, had been withdrawn from service while the military conducts an investigation. A holstered base P320 allegedly had a mysterious accidental discharge without pulling the trigger. Charlton posted to the online commercial forum Canadian Gun Nutz, describing the CBC News piece as inaccurate and promising SIG Sauer would release a statement. congrats. Thats SIGs term for a recall. Then theres the fact that the branches of the military have put the P320 design through their own batteries of testing and found it duty worthy. There are several stories about her in the news for various no reasons, she must be throwing them out by a dozen. They didnt see a problem at all and in fact, saw it as an upgrade over Glock. So your fanboy perjorative falls not only flat but false. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-ZZ6pynGLM According to Section 22.05 of the Texas Penal Code, engaging in deadly conduct with a firearm is considered a felony of the third degree. COPYRIGHT 2021, THETRUTHABOUTGUNS.COM. Seems kind of like a Sig apologist article. If you want to find the lowest form of life on the planet interview any C.E.O. 19 Feb 2021 Military.com | By Matthew Cox A former U.S. Marine and federal agent has filed a $10 million lawsuit against Sig Sauer Inc. alleging that his holstered Sig P320 -- a pistol. Note also that ABC didnt provide any context for the number of suits filed against SIG. The incidents occur outside the forbidden zone, as we disarm before we enter so we stay in assiduous compliance with their nonsensical requirement. Much has been made of Nimoys Spock being the most popular character in TOS, but Id argue that without Shatners over-the-top swagger and brash manner, the balance would be lost. Oh, if you another thread reader asking Wheres the Sig/Glock bashing? The networks report didnt mention lawsuits filed by LEOs (or anyone else) against other gun makers claiming similar alleged design defects. He wasnt aware of it until contacted earlier this week by CBC News and suggested it was relevant in ongoing litigation in the U.S. We look forward to reviewing the incident in discovery in the United States, he said Friday. It was at that point that I knew the gun had a design flaw. Once word of that got out there was an avalanche of sexual harassment lawsuits against Fox news. Charlton, headquartered in Victoria, B.C., for comment on its original story, but neither responded. It upgraded its P320 pistols in October 2018, before the middle school incident, spokeswoman Amanda. Fine. Its a novelty, its got issues! This highly trained Fibbie was doing flips while dancing (breakdancing? One hell of a conspiracy. Not only is it now the designated sidearm of all branches of the U.S. military, there are over a million of them in civilian hands. The guys at the LGS saw only one broken striker but it confirmed what the manager who had the P320 go off and my thoughts. First I have no problem with the Mk 25 or any other Sig thats metal. Mechanical engagement of sear to striker not deep enough (wanted lighter, smoother trigger pull without giving it any hand workmanship required with the deep notch much safer classic systems made since 1900) Result another big fail.
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